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The Vintage Japanese Motorcycle Owners Group: Discussion Forums

Vintage Japanese Motorcycle Owners Group :: View topic - Engine seized from sitting


Engine seized from sitting
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1950specialdeluxe
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Joined: Nov 06, 2017
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Location: Saskatoon, Saskatchewan, Canada

PostPosted: Mon Nov 27, 2017 8:09 am    Post subject: Engine seized from sitting Reply with quote

I recently acquired what I have decided is a 1967 Honda C201 with an 90cc engine.
The engine is seized from sitting, it is currently soaking with a 50/50 mix of ATF and acetone.
It has been like this for about 2 weeks, I have tried rocking it in gear and it doesn't want to break loose.
I would like to free the piston before I decide to take it apart.
I am considering 2 options currently.
The 1st is to get an adapter for my compression tester and modify it to fill the chamber with air pressure,
starting at 20psi and working up to 50psi.
If that doesn't work I would then consider using another method I read about, filling the area above the piston with grease.
Thoughts?
Please don't hold back, I asked the question I can take it.
Thanks
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Rizingson
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Joined: Oct 30, 2009
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 27, 2017 8:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'd have to believe air isn't a good option, and wouldn't waste my time with that. Have you determined the position of the piston within the bore. If it's at the bottom of the stroke you'll most likely have to disassemble. Of your two choices, grease would stand the most odds of success as you'll be able to generate the pressure required, IF the valves are closed and holding and you can make an adapter to fit the plug hole. I think most here would recommend removing the head and using a wood block on top of the piston and a large hammer.
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Billybobbigbear
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 27, 2017 1:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wood block on top of the piston and a large hammer sounds perfect

If at first you don't succeed get a bigger hammer.

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dorT500
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 27, 2017 1:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Billybobbigbear wrote:
......................If at first you don't succeed get a bigger hammer.

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Muzzleloader
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 27, 2017 10:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have a wooden baseball bat just for this purpose.
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fasterspider
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 27, 2017 10:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Billybobbigbear wrote:
If at first you don't succeed get a bigger hammer.


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1950specialdeluxe
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Joined: Nov 06, 2017
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Location: Saskatoon, Saskatchewan, Canada

PostPosted: Tue Nov 28, 2017 4:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for the replies.
I will try the air and then the grease if needed.
I hope to not have to pull it apart yet.
But, if I need to I will.
I will update this when I try it, good or bad.
Thanks for now.
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mnmrider
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 29, 2017 10:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

C201 with the OHC 90CC? Cool, I have one of those, apparently rare in that configuration.
Anyway, how about filling the jug with WD40 let it soak for a while and then the hammer (or baseball bat) method. I'm not joking, I rediscovered the power of WD40 for that kind of problems. It might be better than the grease method.
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B52bombardier1
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Joined: Apr 24, 2015
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 30, 2017 5:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Try some 1000 watt heat gun heat on the cylinder. A propane torch kept moving around might also work. The heat could break the rusty bonds inside the cylinder.

Rick

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1974 Mars Orange Honda CT90
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1950specialdeluxe
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Joined: Nov 06, 2017
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Location: Saskatoon, Saskatchewan, Canada

PostPosted: Sat Dec 02, 2017 9:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Waiting for the adapter to screw into the plug hole.
Will try the heat gun this morning.
My theory is if the chamber will hold air and then heat it up as well.
Kinda talked myself out of the grease method, risk vs reward.
It has been soaking for a month now.
If no results by Christmas, I will begin tearing it down.
Thanks for now,
I will update as things happen.
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B52bombardier1
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 03, 2017 5:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I unlocked my CL100 cylinder with a concoction of kerosene, diesel fuel and alligator blood - this is Louisiana. I may have put a squirt or two of "Kroil" thread penetrant in there as well. It took about 24 hours but I think it was the socket wrench that I used on the flywheel bolt to gently rock the engine back and forth that really did the trick. It broke loose and promptly vomited this vile witches brew out the spark plug hole and onto the shop floor. And then I got even luckier. I applied six volt power to the bike and determined that I had spark at the spark plug. Then I shot some starting fluid into the carb hole, kick started it and she roared to life after a coma lasting many years. It got a carb rebuild after that and a by the book tuneup and has been running well ever since. It does not smoke and starts easily . . . very, very lucky for me. The clutch plates were not even stuck together, glazed or worn out. This on a $200 bike purchase from my ex-boss and I have put over a thousand miles on that bike since nearly three years ago.

Gentle patience is a virtue here on the flywheel. You only have to get it loose a little, then wait. Add more thin lubricant through the spark plug hole. Use your socket to nudge the motor in the other direction, then wait some more. Use that heat gun heat. It could take you a month to free it up but she will eventually yield to your efforts.

Rick

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1972 Candy Jet Green Honda CB500
1972 Candy Yellow Honda CL100
1973 Mighty Green Honda ST90
1974 Mars Orange Honda CT90
1975 Topaz Orange Honda ST90
1976 Shiny Orange Honda CT90
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1950specialdeluxe
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Joined: Nov 06, 2017
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Location: Saskatoon, Saskatchewan, Canada

PostPosted: Sun Dec 03, 2017 4:13 pm    Post subject: Winner Winner Reply with quote

Yesterday, I applied heat from a 1000 watt heat gun and added some WD-40 to the mix.
(I could not find any alligators) Razz
I let it sit for 1/2 hour and then gently rocked it back and forth and it began to rotate.
I continued to soak it and have been pushing it around the garage in gear.
Now I will continue with the next step, fire in the hole.
Thanks for now.
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B52bombardier1
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Joined: Apr 24, 2015
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Location: Bossier City, Louisiana

PostPosted: Sun Dec 03, 2017 5:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ok . . . you are doing well here. Let the heat and the lube juice do its thing and you will soon be rewarded.

Rick

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1971 School Bus Yellow Aermacchi H-D Sprint 350
1972 Candy Jet Green Honda CB500
1972 Candy Yellow Honda CL100
1973 Mighty Green Honda ST90
1974 Mars Orange Honda CT90
1975 Topaz Orange Honda ST90
1976 Shiny Orange Honda CT90
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1950specialdeluxe
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Joined: Nov 06, 2017
Posts: 11
Location: Saskatoon, Saskatchewan, Canada

PostPosted: Wed Dec 13, 2017 7:08 pm    Post subject: Good News Reply with quote

The spark plug adapter arrived, pumped the cylinder up to 80lbs air pressure with no result.
Added some heat and WD-40 and kept rocking the rear wheel.
No luck.
Was talking to a friend at work and he suggested putting a socket on the flywheel and put slight pressure on it.
I worked up the courage to pull the flywheel cover and give it a go.
Less than a minute later, it was free and turning.
Checked compression, about 90 lbs.
No spark, I need to do some research on troubleshooting that problem.
Thanks for the help so far.
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B52bombardier1
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Joined: Apr 24, 2015
Posts: 191
Location: Bossier City, Louisiana

PostPosted: Thu Dec 14, 2017 6:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Its no time for despair yet on that compression number. Your rings might free up a little if you are lucky and you can get it to spark.

Please realize that you need a good six volt battery to get this bike to make a strong spark. At least, this is the case with the other 90 CC Honda bikes from that era but I have no direct experience with your model.

Rick

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1971 School Bus Yellow Aermacchi H-D Sprint 350
1972 Candy Jet Green Honda CB500
1972 Candy Yellow Honda CL100
1973 Mighty Green Honda ST90
1974 Mars Orange Honda CT90
1975 Topaz Orange Honda ST90
1976 Shiny Orange Honda CT90
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