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The Vintage Japanese Motorcycle Owners Group: Discussion Forums

Vintage Japanese Motorcycle Owners Group :: View topic - T20 clutch rattle


T20 clutch rattle

 
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fodder
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 07, 2018 11:00 am    Post subject: T20 clutch rattle Reply with quote

Having rebuilt the engine it is running much better but an issue that remains is a rattle from the clutch. The rattle disappears when the clutch is pulled in. I will get the cover off next weekend and look at the obvious causes like loose nuts but are there any other likely causes?

Thanks for any suggestions.

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ConnerVT
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 07, 2018 11:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Look here: Service Bulletin 75-39
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fodder
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 07, 2018 12:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Fantastic! That's really helpful.

Thanks very much.

Nick

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fodder
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 6:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I took the clutch cover off today, to investigate the rattle. My first problem is that I don't have a socket of the correct size for the basket holding nut! My metrics only go up to 24mm and it looks like it must be a 26mm. I do have some larger non-metric e.g. 1" and 11/8 " but the 1" is too small and the next size up is too big to fit in the recess.

Can anyone confirm that the nut is 26mm?

Thanks.

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dorT500
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 10:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Discountbikespares says 27mm...

https://www.discountbikespares.co.uk/ourshop/prod_972184-NUT-CLUTCH-HUB-GT380250-X7-T350250-SPROCKET-X5-GP-RL.html

At any rate, engine sprocket nut is the same size as the clutch hub nut. If I am reading it right, it also sounds like you may need a socket with a thinner wall.

BTW....while you have it apart, I would make sure that both thrust washers are in there and in their proper locations. Check parts fiche.

Good Luck

EDIT; That nut is a new part number. Part numbers can change for a lot of reasons and we would only be assuming that the socket size of the nut is exactly the same as the original.

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fodder
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 14, 2018 11:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks Dort.

If it is 27mm then, yes, it would probably need to be a thin wall socket as there is not a lot of clearance.

Good call ref thrust washers, I will check these.

I can feel axial movement if I manipulate the clutch basket on the shaft so it definitely needs looking at. One of the suggestions in the bulletin is that the rivets holding the clutch basket components together can stretch. If this is the case then you are supposed to replace the basket but that will be tough these days. Can they be re-riveted by a machine shop if this is the case?

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05c50
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 14, 2018 1:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

fodder wrote:
Thanks Dort.


"Dort" haha I like it. Laughing Laughing

......Paul

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fodder
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 14, 2018 2:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I had a sudden thought, and remembered that I have a set of impact sockets which holds some bigger sizes....

...and yes, there is a 27mm in there!

I have removed the clutch and there is good and bad news:

Good:
- the two thrust washers are present.
- the bearings are good.
- the oil slots on the kick starter gear behind the clutch were properly lined up (I couldn't remember if we had checked that when originally reassembling the engine, and I was fretting about it, so that was a relief).
- the spacer versus depth of clutch housing boss play was within tolerance so I don't need to do anything with that.

Bad:
- there is play between the clutch housing and the gear attached to it by rivets. So the rivets have stretched or the dampers between the sections are a bit tired. So I guess this is the source of the rattle.

I will keep an eye out for a NOS clutch basket but suspect they could be rare. Or maybe I could get this one re-riveted, as I have seen new dampers advertised.

EDIT: I found and ordered a NOS primary drive/clutch basket assembly. Expensive, but I hope it will be worth it, the rattle is annoying!

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ConnerVT
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 15, 2018 6:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

05c50 wrote:
fodder wrote:
Thanks Dort.



"Dort" haha I like it. Laughing Laughing



And the "t" key isn't even anywhere near the "k" key.

Wonder how that happened? Razz
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05c50
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 15, 2018 6:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ConnerVT wrote:

And the "t" key isn't even anywhere near the "k" key.

Wonder how that happened? Razz


Your words, not mine. Wink

...........Paul

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kbts250m
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 15, 2018 9:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

fodder wrote:

EDIT: I found and ordered a NOS primary drive/clutch basket assembly. Expensive, but I hope it will be worth it, the rattle is annoying!


WOW - That's quite a find! I hope it's the right one and it fixes your rattle. If not, and you have access to a small hydraulic press with a pressure gage, you can tighten the rivets. You need to go real slow upping the pressure bit by bit until you can tell the rivets are just starting to compress, then do them in a cross pattern at exactly the same pressure on each one. This fix is not quite as good as a brand new part but if you do it right you will greatly extend the useful life of the clutch assy.

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fodder
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 15, 2018 12:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Fingers crossed it is the right one!

I ordered some new dampers for the clutch basket as well. If the new part is good then I will have a go at refurbing the old one just for interest/as a spare.

I hope "Dort" isn't anything offensive in the US, it just seemed a natural abbreviation of DorT500... Embarassed

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05c50
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 15, 2018 1:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

fodder wrote:
I hope "Dort" isn't anything offensive in the US, it just seemed a natural abbreviation of DorT500... Embarassed


Nah, not at all, I just like to razz dorT500. Wink He certainly likes to dish it out. Sorry for stealing your thread.

...........Paul

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fodder
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 15, 2018 3:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Fair enough!

I would have hated to have insulted a US citizen and blown my chances of getting a visa next time I want to visit the States. I know how vindictive the Donald can be about these things Wink

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